Raising Giant Silk Moths (Cecropias, Polyphemus)
I’ve been raising Cecropia and Polyphemus moths for a few years but I’m still learning about the best ways to do it. Here are instructions based on my experience so far.
The instructions are for eastern Minnesota and west-central Wisconsin – the timing in other places may be different. If you have ideas or other methods that work well, please write and let me know – I’d like to try them.
I raise mostly Cecropia and Polyphemus moths, but I've been trying other species too. This year I've been raising Prometheas, and I have some Buck Moth pupas that I'm hoping will hatch so I can try raising them. One advantage of these Giant Silk Moths (the family Saturniidae) is that the adults don't eat, so it's possible to keep them for a day or two to try to mate them and get eggs.
Lifecycle
Cecropia and Polyphemus Moths hatch from their cocoons in late May or June. They mate and lay eggs in the next day or two – adult moths don’t eat, so they only live for a few days. The caterpillars hatch a week or two from when they were laid. The caterpillars eat and grow all summer, and make their cocoons in August or September. They over winter as cocoons, and the adults emerge the following June to start the cycle over again.
Raising the Moths - Cecropias
Eggs to Caterpillars
Eggs are laid on whatever happens to be around when the female has finished mating. If she’s in a cage, she’ll usually lay them on the walls of the cage. If you put a paper bag in the cage, she’ll lay at least some on the bag, which makes the eggs easier to move or give away.
These eggs were laid on a brown paper bag. They're about 1/8 inch long.
Keep watch on the eggs, and a week or two after they were laid, the caterpillars will start to hatch.
Hatched eggs
Caterpillars
At first the caterpillars are tiny – less than half an inch long - and black with black spines.
First instar caterpillar
Caterpillars’ skin doesn’t grow, so when they get too big for their skin they shed it and expose a new larger skin underneath. Each of these stages between shedding is called an “instar”. Caterpillars will go through five instars before making their cocoon. The skin of each instar is a little different. Here are some later Cecropia instars.
Second instar
Third instar
Fifth instar
Caterpillar Food
The caterpillars will need to start eating right away.
Cecropia caterpillars will eat many different kinds of leaves, but once they start eating, they like to keep eating the same thing. So choose a kind of leaf that you can get plenty of. Be sure you don’t have to collect it near a golf course or anywhere there may have been chemicals sprayed to kill insects.
Here's a list of possible food plants: wild cherry, apple, elderberry, box elder, maple, birch, willow, linden, elm, and lilac. I’ve tried using elderberry and lilac, and the caterpillars are happy to eat either. I usually use lilac because I give most of my caterpillars away, and most people have access to lilac.
Where to keep your caterpillar
For the first month caterpillars are more interested in eating than in anything else, so they will stay with their food plants. If you have a branch of lilac leaves in a jar on your kitchen table, they’ll stay on the branch. But as they get closer to the time when they’re ready to make their cocoons, they’ll start wandering around to find the best place to make it. If they aren’t in some kind of cage, you may lose them.
If they are going to be outside they need to be in some kind of cage that keeps them safe from predators – birds, mice, cats, insects and spiders.
If the cage is made of glass, be sure to keep it out of the sun. The sun heats up the air inside and will cook the caterpillars.
Examples of cages you can use are:
Large glass jars with screen tops
Aquariums with screen tops
Old bird cages with plastic screening wrapped around the outside
Hand made cages using wire, plastic or wood, and wrapped with plastic screening material.
Here’s the kind of cage I make for my caterpillars.
Materials:
Plastic coated fencing that comes in 2 foot high rolls
Plastic screening (also comes in a roll)
2 large (20 inches in diameter) plastic saucers (the kind that are used under large plastic plant pots)
Needle and thread
Instructions:
Unroll enough of the fencing to make a cylinder that exactly fits inside one of the plastic saucers. Cut and fasten the wire cylinder together.
Cut and sew a piece of plastic screening around the outside of the fencing.
Use the two saucers as the top and the bottom of the cage.
A few insect predators can still find their way into these cages through the cracks between the cage and the saucers. To reduce that risk you can stuff the cracks with paper towels, or keep the cages inside.
Smaller cages, like glass jars, should only be used if you’re raising one or two caterpillars. It’s better to use larger cages for larger numbers of caterpillars. If the caterpillars are too crowded they may get sick. The wire and screen cages I make will comfortably hold about 10 caterpillars.
Feeding your caterpillars
You need to find a way to offer the caterpillars fresh leaves but protect them from drowning. Caterpillars aren’t very smart about open water, and if the stems of the plants are in a jar of water, they may climb down the stems and drown. I usually block access to the water with a crumpled piece of waxed paper or plastic wrap that I stick between the stems.
Put fresh leaves in when the old leaves look wilted. Usually the caterpillars will move to the fresh leaves quickly, but check the wilted leaves before you throw them out to make sure you aren’t throwing out any caterpillars.
When I move the caterpillars to the fresh food, I try not to touch them. They seem to do better without much human contact. There are a few other reasons not to touch caterpillars: they can get sick from bacteria from your hands; they are fairly fragile, and even light squeezing isn't good for them. Also, some have stinging spines (Cecropias and Polyphemus don't, but Buck Moth and Io Moth caterpillars do, and the spines can cause painful irritations on your skin).
To be sure I don't throw out any caterpillars, I put all the used leaves into a bucket - a clean 5 gallon plastic pail works well - along with some fresh leaves. If I check on them the next day, any caterpillars that I missed will have found their way onto the fresh food.
Cleaning cages
The caterpillars produce “frass” - droppings - which will need to be cleaned out. When the caterpillars are small, the frass will be small, but when they get larger, the frass will be larger and messier. Clean the cages often, washing them with soap and water, so the caterpillars don’t get sick.
Cocoons
At the end of August or the beginning of September the caterpillars will be about as big as your thumb and ready to make their cocoons. They’ll wander around for a while, looking for a suitable place, and then begin building. They might build on the bars of the cage or on the lilac sticks.
They start by throwing out silk, like spider silk, all around themselves.
They slowly surround themselves with more and more silk until they’re in a white silken cage.
Then over the next day or two, the cocoon will turn brown and you won’t be able to see the caterpillar any more.
Winter
After the cocoons are finished and the weather is colder, you need to put them outside so they can go through the cold of the winter. It’s best to leave them in their cage, and put it in a garage or porch that’s the same temperature as outside. Protect them as well as you can from mice and other animals that might nibble on them.
This outdoor stage is very important - they need to go through a winter because it keeps them on the same schedule as the moths in the wild. When they hatch, there need to be other moths hatching so they have partners to mate with.
They are well adapted to survive our cold Wisconsin and Minnesota winters. If you keep them in a place where they are protected from snow, it's a good idea to sprinkle them with snow periodically, or spray them with water so they get enough moisture.
Spring
The next spring the moths will emerge sometime between the middle of May and the middle of June. The warmer the weather, the earlier the moths will emerge. When it gets close to the right time, check the cocoons every day to be sure not to miss them. It's a good idea to keep the cocoons outside at least until they start hatching.
Emergence
The moths will usually emerge in the middle of the day, and spend the day pumping up and drying their wings.
Here is a series of photos of a moth emerging. This happens very fast - it takes less than a minute - so this is the only time I've been able to watch it.
This is a newly emerged moth before its wings have expanded, with the empty cocoon below.
Here's a link to a short video Mike took of a moth pumping up his wings.
By the time it gets dark they’re ready to fly.
Now you have to know if you have a male or a female moth. Males have very large, feathery antennae. Female antennae are much thinner. Here are some photos to help you see the difference.
Male
Female
If you have a male, release it when it gets dark. If you let it go in the light, it will be visible to predators and it may get eaten.
If you have a female, you have a choice – you can let it go, or you can keep it for another day and watch for a male to come to mate.
Mating
The job of the adult moths is to mate and lay eggs. They don’t eat at all, so they have to get everything done in a few days.
The female moths don’t fly very far – they sit in one place and send out pheromones into the air to attract males. The males scent these pheromones and fly to the females. The males usually arrive very early in the morning just before it gets light. The males fly around, getting closer and closer to the female, until one flies in close and begins to mate.
The mating pair will stay coupled until the next evening. Just before dark they’ll separate and the female will fly off to lay her eggs, and the male will fly away to try to find another female.
If you want to mate your female, keep her in a cage all that night, next to an open window, on a screened porch, or outside, so she can send out her pheromones. Then get up very early the next morning to watch for males. In my experience they always arrived between 4 and 5am. I would bring the cage outside, and wait until I saw the males coming. Then I would open the cage and watch. The female will just sit in the cage, waiting. The males will fly around the cage, flapping their wings against the cage and the walls of the house, and against you. Then, eventually, one of the males will dive in and start to mate. Almost immediately the other males will fly away.
Close the cage and bring it inside for the day. The mating pair will stay coupled until the next afternoon or evening.
Release the male as soon as it gets dark. You can either release the female then, or keep her for a while, until she lays some eggs in the cage, and then release her to lay the rest in the wild.
Don't forget - if she lays eggs in the cage, they will hatch in about a week, and you'll either have to feed them, or release them onto a plant that they can eat.
Other Species:
Polyphemus - life cycle is very similar to Cecropias. Differences: the adults tend to emerge a week or two earlier. Mating takes place in the middle of the night - usually at 12 or 1 in the morning. The caterpillars make their cocoons on the ground - or the floor of their cage - wrapped in a leaf. Although I've seen long lists of foods that the caterpillars will eat (maple, birch, ash, etc.) I've found that my caterpillars are healthiest when they eat oak leaves.
Polyphemus female
Promethea - life cycle similar to Cecropias. Differences: adults are somewhat smaller, and the males and females have different coloring. Mating takes place in the late afternoon - usually between 3:30 and 7pm. I've been feeding my caterpillars Wild Black Cherry leaves, but the list of foods they should be able to eat include apple, ash, basswood, birch, lilac, and maple.
Promethea female
Promethea male
Here are a few other links you might be interested in:
How to Raise Other Butterfly Caterpillars
BugLifeCycles - a site I built to document the life cycles of all kinds of insects
Wormspit - a site about silkworms, silk, and silkmoths
May 8th, 2009 at 11:08 pm
I have several large cages throughout my backyard with newly emerged Female and Male Polyphemus moths of different broods (not related sibling-wise) The Females have been sticking their scent-wand out and the males are just sitting there, perched. There's no light except for the Full moon above (today May 8, 2009) and the same thing is happening in each cage. Will they perk up later and do their job?? These females are the fattest-bodies moths i've ever seen and i'd hate for all of those eggs to go to waste. Any suggestions on how to coax them into "jumping on and jumping in" with the mating process? or is this something that's going to take all night. The cage has adequate airflow and there's plenty of room. The females at one point started flapping around, spit out an egg or 4, and now they're still again poking out the scent wand once again at 1am.
May 9th, 2009 at 5:52 am
I've never tried mating caged moths, so I don't know what will happen. When wild males come to mate my caged females, they do a sort of "dance" before they come in to mate - flapping their wings against the cage, the house, me, anything that's handy. I don't know if that's part of what they have to do, or if they can mate within a cage. I hope yours succeed!
Mine almost always mate at about 4 in the morning. The earlier part of the evening is quiet. So you may have had success already. Let me know!
(Later note - I forgot that you've got Polyphemus Moths, not Cecropias - my Polyphemus moths mate in the middle of the night - 12 or 1. But moths in different places may mate at different times. Where are you?)
May 22nd, 2009 at 3:30 pm
I don't necessarily have an inquiry, but a story to share with a fellow moth lover.
Over the winter, I found over 20 cecropia cocoons at my middle school in the middle of a busy suburb(Overland Park, KS). WHAT A SURPRISE! Over winter, I kept them together in a small aquarium so that they would be on the same schedule as the local populations. Now, the very first have emerged. Last week, I came home to find two beautiful males that emerged while I was at school, and released them that night. A few days ago, I had a female hatch, and she attracted a ragged male the following night. After mating, I released them, but found the female in the morning, who had been laying eggs on our pear and maple trees. Now, I have another fresh male who will be released tonight, and I still have something like 16 more to go! Just a sign that nature can make a comeback, even in the midst of development and human intervention.
May 22nd, 2009 at 3:43 pm
Wonderful story! Have fun with all your moths. It's especially fun to give the caterpillars away to other people - with instructions on how to raise them - and let them experience the same excitement. I've been raising and giving caterpillars away for about 6 years now, and I love it. I also feel like I'm helping our neighborhood in St. Paul recover some of its wild creatures.
June 23rd, 2009 at 6:34 am
Hi There
I have newly hatched Cecropia cats (a few hours) and they still havent started to eat yey. I have Japanese Lilac and common Lilac in the cage. How long does it take for them to start to eat?
Thanks
June 23rd, 2009 at 6:46 am
It may take them a few hours. When the caterpillars are a little distance away from the leaves, it may take them a while to figure out that they have to crawl to eat. But they'll get there.
You could try putting some leaves right next to them, or even laid right on top of them - that usually gets them moving. You can pick some leaves, lay them on top of the caterpillars, and then when they crawl onto the leaves, move the leaves onto the branches that you have stuck in water - so when the picked leaves start to wilt they have fresh leaves to move to.
June 23rd, 2009 at 6:49 am
Hi Marcie
Thanks for your help. Some are crawling along the leaves but not stopping to eat them, they just keep crawling around and around.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:21 pm
Hi marcie! i found a cecropia caterpillar at my friend's house and was able to take it home. She gave me some lilac leaves to take home as food for it but discovered that lilac leaves DON'T stay fresh in ziplock bags! I can always go to their house and grab some leaves but that would be a lot of driving and work. I do have an apple tree and another website said that apple leaves are an option to feed them but we found it eating on a lilac bush and it seems to want to stick to eating that.What should I do? I live in Indiana but again find your advice very helpful. Here is another question. I live next to a small woods with a lot of trees. I was wondering this: Would it be best to realese it in the woods or at my friend's house? This is my first time raising any caterpillars and i am very nervous about my little guy. If you have any other advice for starters I would be grateful for it. Thank you so much for your genuine help. I look up to you with great admiration and respect. Thanks again!
-Fay
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:39 pm
Hi Fay,
A friend who has gotten caterpillars from me - cecropias that have been started on lilac - has switched them to apple without any problem. I'll write her a note and see if she did anything special to help them switch and let you know.
If you can figure out how to get it to eat, it's better for the caterpillar to keep it. Caterpillars in the wild have a very low survival rate. Think about it - a female moth lays hundreds of eggs. If only two of those eggs live to adulthood, the population will stay the same size. So most of the caterpillars that hatch are going to die - either be eaten by birds or spiders or wasps or something.
For the moment I'd stick the caterpillar in a cage with some fresh apple leaves, and leave it overnight to see what will happen. Caterpillars can get along without food for a day or so, so you have some time to figure this out.
August 4th, 2009 at 8:26 am
Thanks Marcie! I am happy to know that!
August 4th, 2009 at 9:12 am
:]
August 4th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
I just got a note from the friend who has switched cecropia caterpillars from lilac to apple. She says that the first time she put both kinds of leaves in the cage, and when it was obvious that the caterpillars were eating the apple, she just didn't replenish the lilac. Now that she knows that it works, she just gives them apple, and they switch right away.
August 4th, 2009 at 6:30 pm
I am glad to hear that. I have another problem though. My caterpillar at first was being kept in a plastic bucket with plastic wrap on the top. I guess I made the air holes too big because the next time I went to check on him, I didn't see him. I looked and looked and finally found him inside the bigger bucket that I was keeping the smaller plastic bucket in. I immediately put him in a glass jar with drilled air holes and some fresh apple leaves but he didn't seem to be moving at his normal pace. In fact he didn't seem to be moving at all except for an occasional twitch of his tail.This all happened before I wrote to you for the first time. I left him in there overnight but he still wasn't doing anything. And he still isn't. I'm very concerned about him. I am afraid that when he escaped and was climbing over the plastic bucket he fell and got injured. What should I do? Changing the subject, this morning when I was taking the glass jar with him in it, which I had opened, two times a wasp flew in and landed on my poor, probably injured, little caterpillar.I shooed them away, horrified. I certainly won't be taking him outside without a cover again! You were certainly right about the predators! Back to the point, I am concerned about my little guy. I put some leaves in front and on top of him but there is still no sign of him eating. Do you have any advice?
August 4th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
:[
August 5th, 2009 at 5:47 am
It sounds like your caterpillar may be sick, or have a parasite. Most caterpillars in the wild don't make it, so it's not surprising - but it's sad when it happens to one you want to raise. Plastic screening is a good thing to use to keep predators out - it keeps out most wasps and flies, and keeps the caterpillars in.
August 5th, 2009 at 8:15 am
I've moved my caterpillar into a aquarium with a screen top.
September 14th, 2009 at 7:34 pm
WOW!! This really a great website. It is so informative. I am really glad I found it!
I am in the Cincinnati, Oh area and we just found one of these giant caterpillars this afternoon when he was crossing the street in my subdivision. I scooped him up and brought him home. Around dusk, he started to throw silk in the tiny temporary container I had him in. In a panic and before I found this website, I moved him to plastic insect container my kids use for bugs that is about 9" by 8" and he has started to throw silk again. Well, this looks like it will be his home for the winter as I am not sure if I will be able to move him to a larger cage again. I had no idea what to expect with this caterpillar but now I see. So cool!
I must say your webpage is so very informative. We (my 3 boys, my wife, and me) all stayed up late on a school night to read everything. My boys are so excited!!!
I will be checking back tomorrow to get more info and I have bookmarked this great webpage. THANKS!!!!
September 16th, 2009 at 2:13 pm
I found a large cocoon encased in an oak leaf last night laying in my driveway. I was wondering if someone could idenitify it. I've taken a picture of it. The cocoon is safely hanging inside a jar currently so that it doesn't get damaged.
Thanks, Laura
April 6th, 2010 at 5:40 pm
Last fall i caught (w/ help of a friend) a caterpillar and it has cocooned and since emerged and I believe it to bw a polyphemus moth. I know it is early in the season for this, but I am in Okla. and it has been kept indoors ina container.
Question; does the female lay eggs even if there is no male present to fetilize them?? It has emerged and all over the walls of the container it seems to be laying little round dots that are sticking to the wall and I'm assuming these are eggs?? I would love it if caterpillars appered from them..but seems from prior information this may not be the case if the eggs are not fertilized. Please send information if possible. My preschool class has enjoyed the whole experience and if we could be so lucky to have caterpillars WOW !!
Thanks You
April 6th, 2010 at 6:46 pm
If it hasn't mated (and you would definitely notice the mating), then the female is dumping her eggs. If she doesn't find a mate in a few days, she'll often do this. So they are eggs, but they won't be fertile. Too bad!
In the future, if you want to mate a female, she has to be on the same schedule as the wild moths. So she should be kept outside over the winter - in a cage or other place that's protected from mice and squirrels. Then when she emerges, there will be males for her to mate with.
June 7th, 2010 at 8:39 am
my cecropia moths hatched last moth (3 males and 2 females) and mated and laid hundreds of eggs all over the cages. the eggs from the first female started hatching 5 days ago and are still hatching. we have had about 1 hundred hatch so far but within a day they almost all died. they crawl around on the leaves and then just sit and die. only about 10 are still alive and have started to eat cherry leaves (these are from the same tree i raised their parents on last year). i also tried offering apple,lilac and maple leaves. we have about 260 more eggs due to hatch next week and i need any advice that can help me save these.thanks carol
June 7th, 2010 at 8:58 am
It's always hard to tell exactly what's going on, but here are a few ideas.
Are you sure the leaves haven't been sprayed with something? Some places are aerial spraying Bt for gypsy moths; people spray their back yards when they're going to have a party; golf courses spray for bugs. Any of those sprays kill caterpillars.
Another thing - less likely, but still possible. Have you raised several generations of inbred moths? If you raise them year after year, and always mate them with your own raised moths, eventually they get so inbred that they get sick. It's better to try to increase the gene pool by breeding them with wild males when you can.
I would bet on the sprayed leaves since it's so sudden and all the caterpillars are dying. You might check to see if NY state has a web site about gypsy moths - they usually talk about what they're doing for treatment. I don't know what you can do about it - I've been writing to people - trying to get them to see that killing all the caterpillars isn't a good plan - but I don't think they're paying attention.
June 7th, 2010 at 9:14 am
we dont spray in our yard but i dont know about neighbors. i dont think they do. the caterpillers dont even seem to eat and i have taken leaves from many different trees in my yard. also last year was my first year with the moths. 6 caterpillers were given to me right before they changed into cacoons (they lived on the same wild cherry leaves)so i dont know if they were related or not. thanks so much for your input .if you think of anything else let me know. i really dont have any experience with them. thanks
June 7th, 2010 at 11:59 am
I don't have any more good ideas. I think I'd try leaves from another tree for the ones that will hatch next week - if it's a problem with the leaves, that may solve the problem. My neighbor has had very good luck feeding apple leaves - they seem to prefer them over lilac. Beware of switching the kind of leaves once the caterpillars have started eating - they usually don't like to switch.
Let me know if you figure it out, or if you try something that works.
June 16th, 2010 at 3:09 pm
I have about 60-70 newly hatched cecropia caterpillars. They are eating lilac and I have discovered a good idea for the newbon cage. They were so tiny i thought they would go through screen so I covered with the White opaque material that I use to cover crops to keep insects or birds off. It allows air and light but no little guys can get through. So far all seem to have gone through an exploration phase and now are eating well. I would like to raise some inside and also make some kind of sleeve to be able to raise them right on the lilac bushes.Any ideas how to make them and if it works. I made "love cages" and had the female bring in a male and they coupled through the cage. He was outside, her inside all the next day. I put them in a pet carrier, cage and all, to protect them. Then I released him and collected my eggs. This is so very interesting and I love your site and comments. Thanks. Pam
June 17th, 2010 at 6:41 am
Sounds like fun - and it also sounds like you'll have a lot of work later in the summer! As the caterpillars grow, they eat more and more.
It's easy to make sleeves - you can make them in the shape of a pillowcase, as large or small as you want, with a drawstring at the open edge. You could make them out of the same material as you used for the screening. It should be fine enough to keep even small insects out, but let in light and air. I would try to put it on the plant so that the drawstring is at the bottom. That way you can open it every few days - more often as the caterpillars grow - to let the frass drop out.
Good luck!
June 17th, 2010 at 10:16 am
Thanks Marcie, I am not a sewer but maybe good tape on that drawstring and fabric. I was just thinking of the several laundry bags I have with drawstrings, they are cotton and polyester. Breathable? Pam
June 17th, 2010 at 11:10 am
Anything that keeps the caterpillars in and the predators out is good. I don't know how breathable polyester would be - you could try it and see.
June 18th, 2010 at 12:45 pm
I have a Polyphemus cocoon that was built last fall by a caterpillar that I found. I put him in a box with several branches and he munched for maybe 5 minutes before checking out every leaf to decide on the right one for his/her cocoon. I put the box outside in an empty rabbit hutch for the winter. We had a pretty bad winter here in western North Carolina, but the cocoon was sheltered from the snow. It has yet to hatch, and I brought it inside last week because some Carolina wrens built a nest in the box and I was afraid they would eat the moth if it hatched. When I put the cocoon on it's side I could feel and hear whatever stage it is in slide around inside (sounded/felt like a chrysalis within a cocoon). Is this normal? I am afraid it is not going to hatch since I have read that this happens in early May in this area. We use the A/C in our house but keep it at 77 F - will this be a problem? If it seems like it is not going to hatch, then I want to open it up and see what happened. I would feel terrible opening it to find that it was almost ready to hatch. Any suggestions/feedback? Thanks, Jamie
June 18th, 2010 at 10:01 pm
This is a great website. I thank you for documenting your experiences on it. I got a couple of questions if you dont mind me asking. My 3 kids (ages 6,7, and 9 )and I found 3 cecropia cocoons over the winter. We live in NE Iowa. The first hatched about a week ago. We found it on the tree just above its cocoon still puffing up its wings. We put it into a cage and it lived in there for a week. (We were waiting and hoping one of the others would hatch and we could mate them.) We thought it was a male since it had large feathery antenna. It was never flapping its wings and attempting to get out. It just sat in there slowly moving its wings and seeming content. One day it started laying eggs all over inside the cage. Obviously it must have been a female. My question is how could it have laid all these eggs when I am fairly positive it was never bred. Are the eggs infertile? They have not hatched yet and it has been close to a week. After about 3 days of egg laying it was flapping around in the cage attempting to get out so we released it into the wild. Thanks for helping us
June 18th, 2010 at 10:12 pm
Just found the answer to my question above. Thanks anyway. Again great website. I released that female Wednesday night and wouldn't you know it, the second cocoon hatched Thursday morning. I think this one is a female (smaller antenna) But I have been wrong before!
Since the first dumped its eggs without being bred, would it have been worth keeping around to be bred or had it dumped all of its eggs and was going to die? I still have one more to hatch.
Thanks
Chris
June 19th, 2010 at 9:09 am
The cocoon is actually just a protection for the pupa, so when you cut it open, you'll see a brown, shiny pupa case inside the cocoon. If the pupa is heavy (sometimes hard to tell if you don't have any experience) it may still be alive. Sometimes live pupae will move or wiggle - kind of like a mexican jumping bean. But it does sound - because it's so late in the summer - like it's not alive, and that it didn't make it through the winter.
Having the cocoon/pupa in your house isn't a problem in the summer. The only time you shouldn't do that is during the winter. The cocoons need to have cold weather in the winter so they are on the same cycle as the wild moths, and will be able to fine mates when they hatch.
June 19th, 2010 at 9:18 am
Once the female starts dumping eggs, I don't think she'll mate. I don't really know - but I've never seen one mate after that.
Are you going to try to mate the female that just hatched? Be sure to put her outside, so she can call in a male. And either have her in a cage that has large enough holes that she can mate through (1/2 inch hardware cloth works well), or get outside in the early morning to open up if any males show up. It's fun to watch the males fly in!
I've never seen moths kept in the same cage mate with each other. The males seem to have to fly in - it seems to be a part of a 'dance' that they do before they actually mate. It's probably a good thing - it would encourage mating between unrelated individuals - better for the gene pool.
Good luck!
June 19th, 2010 at 8:29 pm
If I did cut it open and the pupa was still viable would it still be able to finish developing or would it perish? It feels pretty heavy, like a baby carrot. I have not seen one of these moths around my house for 2 years so it would be pretty cool to release this one.
June 19th, 2010 at 9:40 pm
I think - but I've never done this - that if you cut open the cocoon, the pupa would still survive if it was viable. But if you cut open the pupa, it won't survive. It sounds like it might still be viable - I think you should give it more time to see if it will emerge. You can always cut it open later in the summer.
June 20th, 2010 at 1:02 pm
Thanks again for the info. I do have the newly hatched female outside with in a cage they should be able to breed through. We will see what happens.
June 21st, 2010 at 1:37 pm
my first batch of eggs all hatched (about 150) but only 1 baby lived . it is about 2 weeks old now. a second batch (about 250 eggs) hatched 1 week ago. only 50 lived but are doing good. these were put outside as soon as they hatched in sleves on cherry and silver maple trees . these are all from the same parent moths. how do i go about getting other unrelated moths to avoid inbreeding next spring? i have never seen these moths where i live and the females i hatched this spring did not atract males. is there anywhere to trade some of my cacoons for others?
thanks
June 21st, 2010 at 1:44 pm
Inbreeding is definitely a problem. I know some folks who kept mating their own moths to each other, and after a few years their population collapsed. I'd see if you could find some folks in your area who are raising them, and see what they're doing about it. Where did yours come from? Maybe you could talk to the people you got them from.
June 24th, 2010 at 12:24 pm
i have not been able to find the person i got them from . and i have never seen one in my area. no males even showed up when i had females out at nite. i went on line but could not find anyone who would be interested in trading. i guess i still have time. also as i mentioned last time, i had caterpillers inside and outside in sleves on trees. when i looked yesterday the ones outside were more then twice as big as the ones i have indoors. is it normal that the outside ones grow twice as fast? all are from the same clutch of eggs. thanks carol
June 24th, 2010 at 1:10 pm
I don't usually grow them in sleeves - so I don't know about the size difference. It seems strange that there should be so much difference.
Good luck finding someone to trade with - I'd keep trying. You have until next spring to find someone - until the adults hatch.
June 28th, 2010 at 8:42 am
is it possible that anyone would like to trade with me ? i know i received butterfly catterpillars in the mail this year.they were in the mail almost a 5 days when i got them.they came in a sealed cup with some kind of caterpillar food. is it posible to send the caterpillars after they have changed into cacoons? we could send them fast delivery. i have lots of caterpillars ( maybe 50) so i could send quite a few. they should be able to survive as i know i have seen them for sale on the internet. sending the caterpillars is an option to but i would be afraid of changing the diet. some are on a silver maple tree and some are on wild cherry.i think sending cacoons would be best. thanks
June 28th, 2010 at 10:24 am
It would be much better to exchange with someone in your area, or the person you originally got the caterpillars from. It's not a good idea to mix populations from very different places. Also, it may actually be against the law to send insects across state lines without a special permit - I'm not sure what the rules are.
July 2nd, 2010 at 11:52 am
Hi, I have eggs from a cecropia moth om the walls, screens& curtians in my room. Do I move them before they hatch & lay them on the leaves of a host plant of move the caterpillars after they hatch?
Thank you,
Michelle
July 2nd, 2010 at 1:07 pm
I'd move them soon, before they hatch. They're easy to move. I use my fingernail to dislodge them. The eggs are hard and won't be hurt when you pick them up. A cecropia got loose on my screened porch once, and she laid eggs all over the screens and the window frames. I just pulled them all off and put them in a cage with the host plant leaves, and they all hatched. It's much easier to find the eggs now, than it will be to find the little caterpillars once they start to move. And it's harder to move the caterpillars without injuring them.
July 18th, 2010 at 9:25 am
i found my cecropia caterpillar on my sidewalk and brought him inside. He imediatley started making his coccon. I know he has to spend his winter outside and get some moisture from the snow and rain but what about now? does his cage need misted once in a while till winter?
July 18th, 2010 at 9:39 am
I don't mist the cocoons in the late summer and fall - but I keep them on a screened porch so they get humidity from the air - and we live in a valley that's pretty humid. If you're planning to keep the cocoon in an air conditioned house until winter, it might be good to mist it once in a while - maybe once a week? That's just a guess.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:38 am
several of my cecropia caterpillars have died. first they get a dark spot on them and then it seems to spread. when it covers half their bodys they die. any idea what this could be? the catterpillars are now about 2 inches long . it has been very humid and so hot here the past week ,lots of rain, could this have anything to do with it?
thanks carol